Laptop Program ?

[arizona-dave]

Well, Ive spent some time searching and reading, and Im just not getting all the info I need, So, I turn to creating a new topic.

With that said:

I am considering either getting a Tuned ECU from Nelson Performance, or going with something like the Hypertech, Diablo or Edge.

OR - Im wondering if there is a program available to hook up a laptop to the ECU and flash reprogram it.

Ive found a few laptop interfaces that show readings, including dyno, codes, statistics, but it seems like there should also be programs available to actually reprogram the ECU. Its not that I think I can do any better than Black Bear or Nelson, its that if I want to change something, I dont want to wait 5 days to do so, plus, Id like to learn a little. Nelson Performance says their custom tune to go to 89/91 octane will put 30-35 HP to my wheels...that is quite a claim...but it true, well worth it!

If nobody knows about laptop software available to reprogram the ECU, then I am open to hear the differences between what the Hypertech, Diablo or Edge Evolutions allow one to change.

I want to:
1) Change Air/Fuel & Timing to increase Torque and HP, as I tow and need to pull better up hills.
2) Change the Torque Management (TM), removing about 75%.
3) Change Shift Points for Tranny
4) Adjust for diff tire sizes
5) Remove/Change Speed/Rev limiter

I know the handheld units adjust most of these, but are they pre-programed or does one adjust each setting individually? Or is there option for pre-program or manual adjustment.

All Comments are welcome.

-David

[ms38w]

HP Tuners.  It runs through your laptop and has an interface that plugs into the OBDII port.  You can change many aspects of the stock ECM tune.  This is the same program Nelson uses.  It can be difficult to work with, as there are NO instructions...there is, however, a forum run by HP Tuners dedicated to "teaching" us how to use it...but you need to have a degree in rocket science to understand what they are telling you...no "HP Tuners for Dummies" version, as of yet     .  Before you start fooling around with the tune using HP Tuners, make sure you save the stock tune to your laptop and on a USB device and any other place you  can keep a copy...if you mess up, you will need a good place to start over...and if you lose it due to laptop corruption or lost USB drive, etc., you are done for, and will be paying the dealership upwards of $1000 to flash the ECM. 

That said, you can buy the HP Tuners (about $500) and buy an email tune from Nelson, which you open with HP Tuners and load into your ECM. His tune should run about $500, so $1000 total.

[arizona-dave]

Very good info, thank you! I found another program http://www.nology.com/laptopdyno.html but it looks like its just a scanning tool.

Looks like I have some learning to do! Awesome, Thank you!

HP Tuners.  It runs through your laptop and has an interface that plugs into the OBDII port.  You can change many aspects of the stock ECM tune.  This is the same program Nelson uses.  It can be difficult to work with, as there are NO instructions...there is, however, a forum run by HP Tuners dedicated to "teaching" us how to use it...but you need to have a degree in rocket science to understand what they are telling you...no "HP Tuners for Dummies" version, as of yet     .  Before you start fooling around with the tune using HP Tuners, make sure you save the stock tune to your laptop and on a USB device and any other place you  can keep a copy...if you mess up, you will need a good place to start over...and if you lose it due to laptop corruption or lost USB drive, etc., you are done for, and will be paying the dealership upwards of $1000 to flash the ECM. 

That said, you can buy the HP Tuners (about $500) and buy an email tune from Nelson, which you open with HP Tuners and load into your ECM. His tune should run about $500, so $1000 total.

[shortydog]

HP tuners would be the best, my av is tuned with hp tuners

[arizona-dave]

Awesome info guys, thank you.

I am assuming the HP Tuners flashes the ECU so you dont have to leave the laptop plugged in? But can you keep the laptop plugged in to run Dyno and look at instant performance etc?

Is HP Tuners the same program that all the kids with Souped up Ricers use and people with Turbo's etc?

[arizona-dave]

Im really wanting to put a different Cam in my truck also, so the more im able to tune, the better...but like Ohio said, its complex with no good "how to" manual...But if Nelson can send an email with the program, it would be a good starting point...?

[ms38w]

You use the laptop to read the current (stock) program in the ECM, and copy it to your laptop for reference...or future retuning back to stock.  You then make a "copy" of the stock tune file for the purpose of changing the  paramiters to change things like timing advance/retard, how much fuel the injectors are spraying,etc.  You then drive the truck with the new tune and record a scan of what the trucks ECM is reading about the engine...intake air temperature, exhaust gas temp, speed, RPM, throttle position, etc., everything the ECM looks at, you can look at...recorded for viewing as necessary. Then you save the new tune separately from the stock tune and separately as a copy to readjust.  Little steps at a time, always saving the current tune and a copy of the current tune to adjust...always one you don't mess with so you can go back and look to see what did and didn't help.  You can drive down the road with the laptop hooked up and look at all the aspects the ECM is using to figure what it needs to do, all in real-time.  Save the scans for  later viewing while adjusting the tune.  Get the idea?

  A Nelson tune is one you buy from him.  You tell him what make, model, year of vehicle, any modifications you have made to the engine, etc., and he will write a tune and email it to you.  Using HP Tuners, you open the  file Nelson emails you, and load it into your ECM.  You record a scan and email it back to him.  He will look to see what improvements he needs to make to his tune, makes the changes and emails the file back to you.  You reprogram the ECM again.

  If you ever change anything with the engine...add a turbo, headers, cam, heads, rebuild the engine to stroker standards, etc., email him your current tune file along with the changes you have made to your engine, and he will change the tune to suit your new engine dimensions, etc.

[arizona-dave]

MS38: Thats exactly the information what I was looking for! Thank you.

Now the question is, do I try and learn this myself, or go with that custom Nelson Tune ECM...decisions decisions. Im going to do a tad more research into this and see what results people are really getting.

My end goal within the next 6 months is a new Cam and headers. Ive got the CAI and magnaflow exhaust from cat-back, so the only two things I can do except charge it, is cam and programming.

Since Im the OP I guess I can jack this thread a little and ask if anyone having good luck with particular Cams? Ive found 2 ways to go, the GM Performance Cam for the 5.7L Escalade engine, which supposedly is just a tad over the 5.3L and the computer will learn, or the Extreme XFI Truck Cam which requires springs and rockers, and a custom tune.

Id have to go look up the specs, but the lift on the Truck Extreme is 206/212 @0.5 and the 5.7L GM 196/201 @ 0.5 (thats actual lift @0.5, not total advertised lift)

Anything more than those mods, and I will just go find a used 6.0L L76 or LQ9 engine to swap in it. 

[ms38w]

  If you're at all handy and plan on doing the mechanical work as well as the programming, by all means...learn HP Tuners (once you figure it out, PM me how to work it!     ).  If you feel comfortable tinkering around with the tune, then it's worth a shot...and save the $500 you would have spent on a Nelson tune to go towards the other mod's you want to do.  Just make sure you save the stock tune to it's own file on your laptop, etc. so you don't end up with a 6000 pound paper weight!  If you just can't figure out HP Tuners, or can't get a good tune going, you could always buy a Nelson tune later.  It's the simplest way to get a tune, but it is $500.  Now, the HP Tuners will work on more than one vehicle.  If you have other cars or friends looking to tune, you might be able to share the cost of HP Tuners.

  As far as the cams you mentioned...some one else would have to help you out there.  I don't know a lot about them.  I would suggest talking to the manufacturer or supplier of the cams you are interested in.  Tell them exactly what you have...engine, intake, exhaust, etc., tell them the goal you have for power/performance and they should be able to tell you the best cam they offer for what you want to do.

  Another option for increasing power would be to have your stock heads worked.  Porting/polishing allows the air to flow better and will increase throttle response while adding HP/TQ and fuel efficiency.  Stiffer springs allow for higher RPM's and better reliability, as well as you to up the compression safely.  Higher compression will give you more HP.  I read an article in one of those "Hot Rod" or other magazines where they took a 4.8L and with a little machining and a tight budget, got 700HP.  They then went nuts with turbos and some other high end goodies and racing gas and made something like 1200HP.  If that's what you are looking to do, you don't have to swap the engine.  Any stock engine of a larger size will give you more power than the smaller engine, but for the money...rework the existing engine...the blocks are all the same, basically.

[arizona-dave]

All the stuff I used to do on my 78 Camaro!!! :-)

I contacted Nelson Tune and a custom tune from them is now only $300 + shipping, so thats really good !!! Better than $500 for sure. For $75 more you keep your own ECU, so $375+shipping gets you 2 Tunes :-)

Im for sure going to change the Cam out in the next year, Im debating which one. Ive considered Polishing and Porting, but thats a lot of down time, and in the past Ive run into issues re-seating GM heads, but maybe things have changed since the old days.

Im now down to 2 choices: Nelson or HP....Maybe I do Nelson and then get HP and start tinkering!

Thanks!

  If you're at all handy and plan on doing the mechanical work as well as the programming, by all means...learn HP Tuners (once you figure it out, PM me how to work it!     ).  If you feel comfortable tinkering around with the tune, then it's worth a shot...and save the $500 you would have spent on a Nelson tune to go towards the other mod's you want to do.  Just make sure you save the stock tune to it's own file on your laptop, etc. so you don't end up with a 6000 pound paper weight!  If you just can't figure out HP Tuners, or can't get a good tune going, you could always buy a Nelson tune later.  It's the simplest way to get a tune, but it is $500.  Now, the HP Tuners will work on more than one vehicle.  If you have other cars or friends looking to tune, you might be able to share the cost of HP Tuners.

  As far as the cams you mentioned...some one else would have to help you out there.  I don't know a lot about them.  I would suggest talking to the manufacturer or supplier of the cams you are interested in.  Tell them exactly what you have...engine, intake, exhaust, etc., tell them the goal you have for power/performance and they should be able to tell you the best cam they offer for what you want to do.

  Another option for increasing power would be to have your stock heads worked.  Porting/polishing allows the air to flow better and will increase throttle response while adding HP/TQ and fuel efficiency.  Stiffer springs allow for higher RPM's and better reliability, as well as you to up the compression safely.  Higher compression will give you more HP.  I read an article in one of those "Hot Rod" or other magazines where they took a 4.8L and with a little machining and a tight budget, got 700HP.  They then went nuts with turbos and some other high end goodies and racing gas and made something like 1200HP.  If that's what you are looking to do, you don't have to swap the engine.  Any stock engine of a larger size will give you more power than the smaller engine, but for the money...rework the existing engine...the blocks are all the same, basically.

[arizona-dave]

Found Diablo makes a Laptop program called CMR: http://diablosport.com/index.php?module=htmlpages&func=display&pid=8

But it looks super expensive at the current time.

One thing Ive discovered is that Diablo Predator and Trinity hand held tuners can upload the current tune in your ECU and save as a custom tune, you can then make modifications to some of the parameters inside the Diablo.

I think the CMR program is the full-blown thing allowing modification of everything.

There is one other Laptop program called RoadRunner, but by the sounds of it HP Tuners is more common.

Thay are all above my price point right now, for $300+shipping I think my first step will be the Custom Nelson Performance tune, and then do a Cam upgrade later this year and go from there.

[we_fly_high]

Ever figure out what you wanted to do with this Dave?

[arizona-dave]

Im thinking of getting the new programmer from Blackbear, they provide a custom tune for you and then your able to flash the tune. Plus it reads codes...all for around $600.

Ever figure out what you wanted to do with this Dave?

[we_fly_high]

Thats not bad at all, and Justin is awesome at what he does. I just didnt know he was coming out with a handheld. Should be the same concept though, he can email them directly to you to flash in.

[arizona-dave]

Yeah, its called the AutoCal here is a link to their website:
http://www.blackbearperformance.com/autocal.asp

Im leaning toward it for now. I busy remodeling my kitchen so the truck is on back burner for a month or so...but I want to get a Tune, Cam and maybe Headers prior to towing season.